When did this happen?

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When did this happen?

Postby kerchi » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:19 pm

I was going to add the Keswick at War site to the list of websites on the forum's home page only to find that it is no longer available. I'm gutted. This was a great site.
In memory of John Bardgett (15309 L/Cpl.), 11th Border Regiment who died 1st July 1916.

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Re: When did this happen?

Postby mrdeacon » Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:19 pm

What an absolute shame this happened, Steve has done a lot of hard work.
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby kerchi » Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:35 am

I haven't heard from Steve in a long time; anyone else seen him recently? Wondered how he is getting on.
In memory of John Bardgett (15309 L/Cpl.), 11th Border Regiment who died 1st July 1916.

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Re: When did this happen?

Postby spike » Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:57 pm

I do know what happened here..... Steve and i exchanged some emails regarding his removal of the site

I don't think he'll mind me sharing the gist of them with you lads :-

Now then long time no speak, I have been contacted by someone who writes
books for Bookends of Carlisle and Keswick who wanted to use the photos
and information on my Keswick at War site for a book about the same I
told him no but as he points out most is freely available he is going
ahead any way, so I have removed my site from the web to make it as
difficult as possible hopefully it will take him twenty years like it
did me but with the interweb probably not, I just thought I would warn
you that there are people who are prepared to make money out of the war
dead, to be honest it makes my skin crawl and I doubt very much whether
my site will ever re-appear, be careful mate you might be next. This is
the pillocks site http://www.cumbrianhistory.co.uk maybe I am overreacting
but I really am p*****d off about this.

Steve


Hi Steve,

I know what you mean, it's not a very nice way to put it, "I'll go
ahead anyways". Says a lot about the person concerned. I totally
understand your position on this.
Mine is slightly different.... I do my work on my site to further
the remembrance of the men concerned and to keep their
sacrifice in memory. In a way his books will also achieve this.....
The fundamental tenet of my sites is free information for all
and the commemoration of brave men and their stories
(and not charging for pictures like some sites), unfortunately
that includes the "author" concerned....

If I were you, I'd contact him one last time to tell him exactly
what your site is about and your reasons for creating it.
Then thank him roundly for being such a good "historian"
(if lazy research is good history) and so honest in his intentions.
(irony ever irony) .Then never speak to him again.....

Personally , I hope you reconsider your decision as your research
deserves an audience, a one better than he has afforded you....


Regards,

Spike

> Thanks Mate I appreciate your input, I will give myself chance to calm
> down but to be honest I think it is the end of the long long road for
> me, as you say we do what we do to keep their memory alive and freely
> available and I have always supplied any information requested to
> anybody who wanted it, it is the profit motive that kills it for me the
> lads have already paid in full and that's where I dig my heels in.
>
> If you know anybody willing to take over the site I will be more than
> happy to hand it over lock stock and smoking barrel.
>
> Steve

Why don't you cut him off at the knees(so to speak) and offer
the site to the local historical society or Keswick council(many
councils seem to be attempting to do something to commemorate
the centenary of the war). They usually appoint someone to head
it and hope for the best. Perhaps your research could benefit the
good people of Keswick before he trawls it.
He may also think twice about taking on the council and the more
people see it, the more he looks like a plagiarist......


Regards,

Spike


Spike thanks for your reply, the problem is that this t*** stated to me
the book is just about finished and he was just asking my permission,
when I telt him to get stuffed he said well most of it is in the public
domain, which it is, so he can say he went round collecting all the
information himself and there is nowt I can do which is what has rattled
my cage, has he done the rounds and spent years researching or has he
spent a few weeks in front of a warm PC copying the info off my site, I
know what my money is on but there is sod all I can do about it.

The idea about the Council or local history society might be worth
looking at but I have been in contact before flagging up the site and
asking did they have any information they could not be arsed to reply, I
have had contacts from all over the world and many other places but very
few if any from Keswick, the last just before Xmas was from a RAF
Squadron historian who had received some photos and postcards that
belonged to one of my Bomber Command lads there were three Clark
brothers on bombers two were killed, anyway he wanted to return them to
any members of the family still around, I made several inquiry`s
including with the local paper I rang them and sent them full details
copy of the email I received and link to the page on my site - again
they could not be ar*** to even say foxtrot oscar.

This coupled with the bloody website provider who I have used for the
last 7 years who continue to make their site more and more complicated
in an effort to make it easier to use, I don`t understand what anything
does anymore it seems intent on self destruction at the slightest
provocation., or maybe I
am just getting far to old for this :-D .

You know marra I feel better for having written this, even if it is
b*******s.

Best wishes

Steve


Perhaps a salutary lesson for all of us......
I think Steve is quite angry and perhaps his choice of words shows this....

If anyone is willing to take on Steve's site, I'll gladly pass on his
email to you and make an intro and you can contact him to discuss it
(I'm busy with my sites at present and my research is not good enough to do justice
to Steve's work.....)
SPIKE

LINK - Border Regiment in the Great War Websites
(right click and open in new tab)

In memory of -19455 Private John Farrer,
A Company 11th Border Regiment k.i.a. 1st July 1916
.
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby plbramham » Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:39 pm

Spike please pass this to him:
I have made considerable research for several years and taken photos regarding South Lakeland men, especially Kendal, and never mind sharing them with anyone. However not for them to obtain any commercial gain! ( I have produced a Border Regiment Roll of Honour for Kendal Parish Church, plus am assisting the town's school and council with a WW1 exhibition and a play by the school - for no pay!)
I do expect some of the images and info to be "lifted" or used by others, but his "offender" is correct in that mostly are out of copyright and they are generally all in the public domain. It's just it's your time and research being used.
It don't mind any info I find to be shared or deprived from others, but I appreciate the point about them being used for commercial purposes.
Perhaps suggest that if that is the case , he could suggest to the author of the publication that at least a portion of proceeds should go to such as The Royal British Legion or the Military Museum at Carlisle?
Perhaps that could resolve the problem as I would love to see the site, and all his work, re-instated in some form?.
Regards Paul
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby spike » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:23 pm

Paul
I think the author stealing his labours was the last straw of an increasingly frustrating battle with his web site , it's hosting company and the changes they were forcing on Steve
I know, mine have stopped letting new sites use HTML after I just about got used to it.......
Sometimes it all seems too much hassle
And then someone comes along and tells you he is going to pinch your research.......
SPIKE

LINK - Border Regiment in the Great War Websites
(right click and open in new tab)

In memory of -19455 Private John Farrer,
A Company 11th Border Regiment k.i.a. 1st July 1916
.
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby mrdeacon » Tue Jul 15, 2014 8:25 pm

It looks like he has done a Cockermouth one so that is me buggered !!!!
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby kerchi » Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:58 pm

I like the way he is standing by his principles. I totally agree with him but I wouldn't go as far as removing a sterling site such as that based on that argument alone. If everyone did that there would no decent sites out there. It is frustrating though that so many people are making money from public domain information and photos especially at this time (they have every right I guess if they are publishing their own words).

Using someone else's hard work for your own gain though is a big no no! So, again, I agree with Steve on that. There seems to be more at play here and combined with hosting nightmares (believe I know about those) and technology just getting more and more complicated I can totally understand the decision.
In memory of John Bardgett (15309 L/Cpl.), 11th Border Regiment who died 1st July 1916.

Any problems, comments or questions about the forum? Contact me at: admin@border-regiment-forum.com
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby hussar1000 » Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:05 am

I hope this site reappears in the future as it was a very informative one.
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Re: When did this happen?

Postby hussar1000 » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:44 pm

Glad to see the site is up and running again.
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